Request Ninten/Ness

Discussion in 'Characters' started by nykunlv, Apr 28, 2013.

  1. nykunlv

    nykunlv Level 0: Newbie

    I know this would be fairly tricky.... because you don't actually Ninten/Ness or any other of the Mother/Earthbound characters actually perform anything, but it would be a nice set up with a Mother skin.... We can all dream, can't we? Keep up the great work.
    Earthboundlover likes this.
  2. Earthboundlover

    Earthboundlover Level 2: Koopa

    Ness actually could work really well. He has hp, he only gets hp restore items from ? Blocks, he gets attacks from defeating enemies and his normal attack would be Bash.
  3. French rocks

    French rocks Level -1: Banned

    It'd be great if you could explain a concept for the character, so we could understand your idea(s), and give it a chance to be included in SMBC.
    Earthboundlover likes this.
  4. Earthboundlover

    Earthboundlover Level 2: Koopa

    Ness could get a set exp for each enemy (example Goomba 1 exp, Koopa Troopa 2 exp) and after a set level he gains a new attack NOT THE BRAWL MOVESET HELL NO HE DOESN'T HAVE PK FIRE, THUNDER OR STARSTORM! He should have different levels to and a PP bar like MegaMan's Ammo Bar, except all attacks take off the same bar.

    The attacks would be PK Flash and PK Rockin. He would also get HP healing PSI like Lifeup. PSI Magnet and Shield would be frustrating to implement and PK Teleport would be game breaking. Paralysis could pause enemies temporarily.
  5. MissingNo2

    MissingNo2 Level 9: Spike Top

    Let's rather focus on ideas for Ninten, since he's the one from the NES.
    Earthboundlover likes this.
  6. Earthboundlover

    Earthboundlover Level 2: Koopa

    Ninten would be be MUCH harder because:
    1. He has NO offensive PSI
    2. Ness has at least SOME room for stretching. Ninten on the other hand, can NOT learn PSI. Teleportation was always there, but your brain has to be reminded of how to do it.
  7. Sergy92

    Sergy92 Level 7: Bloober

    Ness couldn't use PK Fire, Thunder and Starstorm in Earthbound yet he did in Smash Bros.
    MissingNo2 likes this.
  8. Hikari no Kaze

    Hikari no Kaze Level 2: Koopa


    Ness is getting attention


    Here are my thoughts on the issue (for a summary, read just the bold part) :

    The biggest problem with Ness is that he is primarily a healer and physical attacker/tank. At first I thought that the "caster" is an archetype not present in the current core characters, which would make Ness a great new addition to the roster; however, offensive casting really isn't a thing he does beyond his one big attack, and healing moves are not really a thing that can exist in SMBC as it stands.

    As much as I HATE to say it (Earthbound is my favourite game, and I'd love to see Ness in as his own character), I think Ness would work best as a Link skin. The sword is his bat, the boomerang is his yo-yo, the bow is his slingshot, and the bomb is PSI Rockin'. It's more or less perfect. IDEAL (not necessary) changes would be:

    :bbr: An attack animation that makes him look like he's swinging the bat rather than poking enemies with its tip. The current hitbox (err... hurtbox?) could probably be justified if he was simply doing a baseball swing - the wind-up could all happen within the confines of his sprite, with the swing itself just hitting that narrow spot in front of him. Dunno if this is a feasible animation to make with the current spritesheet though.

    :bbr: Instead of bombs, having him collect some sort of PP-restoring powerup, with each one restoring enough PP for one PSI Rockin' [whichever version we decide is best]. Each use would subtract that many points from his total, much like Sophia's triple missile. Might get a bit hard to gauge depending on how weird/high the numbers are, but Alpha at least should probably be workable, right?

    :bbr: Possibly altering bomb explosion times? It would make more sense to have it explode instantly, or perhaps on a shorter timer than the normal bomb (perhaps using the bomb sprite to make the whole thing into a fluid attack animation). However, the current mechanic would be workable, so this idea would only be for if people think it makes sense (game-balance-wise and looks/fidelity-wise) and would be worth it.
    Alkerion likes this.
  9. Earthboundlover

    Earthboundlover Level 2: Koopa

    Ness can learn PSI, but Ninten can't.
  10. MissingNo2

    MissingNo2 Level 9: Spike Top

    AHahahahahah... no.
    "Earthboundlover" aka mister incorrect title, Ninten does in fact learn PSI if you even remotely pay attention.
  11. Earthboundlover

    Earthboundlover Level 2: Koopa

    YOU DO NOT KNOW ABOUT ONE OF THE MAIN THINGS IN THE MOTHER SERIES! THE PSI IS ALWAYS THERE, IT IS JUST LOCKED IN THEIR BRAIN! Wanna know how I know that? Lucas and Claus both always have PSI, they just don't know how to use it.
  12. MissingNo2

    MissingNo2 Level 9: Spike Top

    You just said that Ninten wasn't capable of learning it period.
  13. TheomanZero

    TheomanZero Level 9: Spike Top

    I wouldn't call that "one of the main things in the Mother series" so much as "a subtlety that nobody cares about". In either case, what does it have to do with how they would play in SMBC?
    MissingNo2 likes this.
  14. Earthboundlover

    Earthboundlover Level 2: Koopa

    Read every comment on this thread and you will find the answer.
    I meant he couldn't learn it from outside sources. He was born with the PSI he had at the end. PK 4th D Slip is his and his alone, and I always thought it strained him because he doesn't know where Teleportation is going to end up.
  15. TheomanZero

    TheomanZero Level 9: Spike Top

    As far as I can tell, if you put Ness or Ninten in SMBC, they would gain PSI abilities by collecting power-ups. Whether they're learning new abilities or awakening latent ones is irrelevant.
    MissingNo2 likes this.
  16. Earthboundlover

    Earthboundlover Level 2: Koopa

    I was being stubborn and hardheaded. I should of just stopped before I replied and looked at another post.
  17. JamesBond007

    JamesBond007 Level 1: Goomba

    I could imagine Ninten, Ness and Lucas as skins for Link. Here are Link's power-ups and possible counterparts.

    Wooden Sword - Wooden Bat. Mother 1 also has the weakest Plastic Bat, but let's stay with the wooden model.
    Boomerang - Boomerang. This item appears in Mother 1 as well.
    White Sword - Aluminum Bat. Stronger model.
    Blue Ring - Pendant. There are few pendants in Mother 1, but here let's give the same effect as the Blue Ring - no damage from bombs. However, unlike Link, Ninten's clothes will not change.
    Magical Sword - Hank's Bat. Ninten's strongest weapon.
    Red Ring - PK Beam. In the original, Ana used this PSI attack, but we can give it to Ninten in SMBC. Like the Blue Ring, Ninten's clothes won't change.
    Magical Boomerang - Magical Boomerang. Mother 1 does not include upgraded boomerang, but currently I don't have any other ideas.
    Bombs - Bombs. They can be used in the original game.
    Bow & Arrows - Slingshot. Like said, there is no slingshot in original Zelda and there is no Bow & Arrow in original Mother.
    Fire Arrows? - PK Fire. Giving this power-up to Ninten will require a counterpart for Link.
    Ice Arrows? - PK Freeze. Another one. Could have the same effect as Samus's Ice Beam.
    Light Arrows? - PK Thunder. Could use Sophia III's Homing Missile mechanic, but this will mean homing arrows for Link.
    MissingNo2 likes this.
  18. MissingNo2

    MissingNo2 Level 9: Spike Top

    ... Those never happened in Zelda 1. Ever.
    TheomanZero likes this.
  19. TheomanZero

    TheomanZero Level 9: Spike Top

    As Earthboundlover pointed out, Ninten and Ness couldn't use elemental PSI in their original games. While that alone is not a reason to avoid it (it worked very well in Smash Bros.), giving Link new power-ups he never had in Zelda 1 just so that Ninten and Ness can have PSI attacks they never had in Mother and Earthbound is simply ridiculous.
    Hikari no Kaze and MissingNo2 like this.
  20. JamesBond007

    JamesBond007 Level 1: Goomba

    Don't worry, we could replace Bow & Arrows with PK Fire, but this will mean only two PSI attack for Ninten - PK Beam and PK Fire. Also, certain character have skin differences, like Samus & Pit. I could imagine PK Fire being closer to SSB equivalent - unlike Link's Bow & Arrows, it could have limited range and you could only shoot it forward (not up or down). However, when you hit an enemy, it will leave a pillar of flame on the ground for few seconds (similar to Mega Man's fire weapon). When an enemy (like Goomba) walks in, he will take damage. Speaking about PK Beam - shooting in all directions should still be allowed.

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